Calvin Vlaanderen, welcome to the show. Thanks. Thanks for having me. I just heard that I'm the first guest. So make me feel honored. Motocross is not my life. It's something that I do in my life. And that's been important for me to realize and to also accept I'm not going to die for the sport. Calvin Vlaanderen is a professional motocross GP racer.

for the Monster Energy Yamaha team. He's an MX2, MXGP, and Motocross of Nations race winner, and he wants more. Maybe I wasn't the most flashy guy, but I am quite consistent, and maybe that is why I'm still here today. And he wins Race 1 here in South India! What was the hardest moment for you throughout your career, and was there ever a moment where you thought, I don't want to do this?

I just want to say a big thanks to my family. Always there for me. My team, they've given me everything the last three years. Just to give them back this result is just awesome. Unfortunately now I got injured a couple weeks ago. But that's part of the sport. And now all my eyes are on next year. We talked about Onifans.

Yes. What do you think about Onlyfans? Like being into sport


Calvin Vlaanderen, uh, welcome to the show. Thanks. Thanks for having me. I just heard that I'm the first guest. So make me feel honored. It's uh, yeah, it's been a long time. Um, uh, since back in, uh, Killarney days. Yeah. Long time. Um, like I said, a couple of minutes ago, I don't really remember the last time that I saw you.

Um, obviously know who you are. I followed you the last years. Can't say very closely because obviously I was busy with my own thing, but, uh, Yeah, it's very cool to see we are in a different country now and obviously going our separate ways, we're in different directions. You went to downhill and I was obviously continuing with moto.

Yeah. It's cool to catch up with you, I'd say. It's uh, yeah, it's wild actually to think back to, you know, uh, the last time I really remembered you that I'd seen you in person, I mean, you on 85s and 65s, like, you know, And a race or training or, yeah, at one of the events. And obviously I knew you and your brother and, um, and your, your dad was always like, he's one of the people that stuck out because he was there for years for you and the whole family.

And, uh, now to see the direction that you've gone, uh, it's, uh, it's pretty crazy to think where it all started. I mean, I think when people see the scene in Cape town and see what it's like here, and it's mind boggling actually to think that you've made it to this point. Yeah. Yeah. When, when you at that age, like 85 or 65 or whatever, you don't ever think, I mean, you have dreams to come to Europe to race too.

And when you hear, like, for example, now, um, the last years, like when you're really in it, when you have an injury or you have a setback, you really sometimes take a step back and you take like a bird's eye view of like what you've accomplished and where you've come. And you're like, damn, like actually done quite good for myself and quite well for myself.

And I can be proud of myself, but when you're in it, You always want more. You always like, always on to the next thing. You always, what can I achieve next? What, you know? So it's, yeah, it's cool to think back to the days, Kalani days, just the average, you know, kid from Cape Town, both of us, you know, just, uh, and look how far we've come.

So it's very cool to, to look back and, uh, and see it and think about it. It's yeah, it's interesting because I think, um, you know, back then I, few names stick out obviously like Caleb and, uh, Matt Hildeney think back in the day. When you were racing, I would have, don't say this the wrong way, but I would have never, um, you weren't the flashiest of riders, especially when you were well, when you were younger, but you were super consistent and you were always there.

And, um, I think ultimately that's what's led you to being able to get to this point because. I think it's not always the one who's, who's taking the most risk and, and, you know, they end up getting injured and have all sorts of other problems. So it's, it's wild to think that now you're the one that's really made it to the top of the sport.

Um, cause I think maybe some people wouldn't have thought that back when you were younger, they would have thought the flashy guy who's, you know, doing worse and this and that. I mean, I still haven't made it to the top of the sport. Um, well, I mean, I, I, in a, in a, in a way, yes, because, Let's say maybe 0. 1 percent of the, of the world.

Um, um, I mean, top, top five of the, of the world at the moment. And, uh, that is, you know, 0. 1 percent or whatever, but, um, my goal is still to be world champion, but like you say, maybe I wasn't the most flashy guy or whatever, but I did, I was consistent and that's, Still to this day, kind of my, my strength, you know, I'm not really the most flashy rider on track, but I'm quite consistent and I have, um, you know, proven that the last, the last years, and maybe that's, is why I'm still here today.

I think that's, you know, that's, uh, shows you again, that talent is. I mean, you need a certain amount of talent, but I think when you're willing to work hard at something, I think talent, uh, work, hard work beats talents, you know, for sure. And, and, uh, I have definitely worked hard, uh, to get to where I am, but obviously, um, definitely talented, um, but definitely have helped has helped.

And, uh, but it doesn't talent only gets you a certain level. And when you. Get to, um, 15, 16 years old. It's not just talent that gets you to a good level. I think, I think that's also, that's when you need to start working. And I think it's in every sport like that. And, uh, I mean, now you've just signed with, well, not just, but relatively, uh, short time ago you signed with Monster Energy Yamaha.

Yeah, correct. Uh, when, when was it the beginning of the year? Right. Um, I mean, yeah, this was something that's been working in the last couple of years. Um, I signed with Yamaha in 2020. as like a privateer team. Um, and my goal was always to get to the factory team, uh, hopefully sooner than later. Yeah. It's, it was quite challenging the first couple of years, and that's also why I didn't take that next step to the factory team.

But now last year results and everything, they could see the progress and see that I was ready. And then they moved me up to the factory team. So the end of, um, End of 2023, I um, I signed. Yeah, it's quite a, I guess that brings also, I mean it's, on the one hand it's awesome, it's a great opportunity, but on the other hand it brings pressure and things like that, you know, to deliver.

Big time. And then, um, I guess it must have been quite frustrating now getting, you know, signed. Getting injured now, how's that been going? How are you feeling? And when, when's the sort of a plan, I guess, to, to get back on the bike? When you signed for a factory team, I mean, it's been my goal since like, I moved up to MXGP, you know, I was in a factory team with Honda in 2018, 19 with MX2.

And then I moved up to 450s in the premier class and they didn't Re sign me for honda. That was ultimately ultimately my goal back then Um, obviously look for another option and I went to another team, which was good for me Honestly, I learned a lot in those years. Yeah I learned a lot of for myself But also what I need in the bike and what I needed in a team and everything like that moving up to that factory signing that factory deal was like kind of relief off my shoulders, but also like You Okay, shit.

This is like, this is shit gets real now. You know, almost like I need to work harder or I need to prove myself more or, uh, the pressure was definitely higher, more pressure than, than I felt before. Um, but it's good for me. I want to be in that position. This is what I've been working for. And, um, so this year, um, I definitely, I've taken a good step.

I feel like I've improved a lot, not only with my writing, but also mentally. Yeah. I knew that I needed to improve with, with that mentally. The, uh, So that was, that was a good step that I've made this year. Unfortunately, now I got injured a couple of weeks ago, which has taken me out of the championship. I was lying fourth in the championship at the time.

And that was my goal to finish inside the top five. Last year, were you sixth or seventh? I was sixth in the championship last year. Uh, that was just a good season. But now my next goal was to be inside the top five. I was fourth. It was looking good. I was comfortable at fourth. And you just recently just won as well again, or you know, so you've been on the podium.

I got on the podium twice. Yep. Which is also definitely good. Uh, that's also, yeah. So it's, I was thinking of the boxes getting, uh, getting through the season and then unfortunately happens, but that's part of the sport. And, and, uh, now all my eyes are on next year, but I can be proud of the year that I've had.

Looking, looking back, I've definitely, yeah, had a good year and I'm happy with the year that I've had. So let's try to build off of that for, for next season. Yeah. How old are you now? 28. 28 already? Yeah, man. Wow. How old are you? Uh, I'm 30, just turned 34. 34, right? Yeah. That's why racing, like growing up, you were in a little bit of an age category higher than me.

Um, wow. Yeah, it's crazy because the time just goes. Maybe on that topic, we can shift gears a little bit and rewind to starting. Like, how, where did it all start, like getting into the sport and why, why motocross? What was it that attracted you to the sport? Good question. Like why did you do motocross, you know?

It's just. It's like, it was a hobby of my dad's and he was, um, he wasn't allowed to ride dirt bikes because of his parents didn't get him, didn't get him a bike and didn't allow him to ride. So he was like, okay, when I have kids, I want them to ride bikes. Cause I never got the opportunity to do it. When we could ride a bicycle without training wheels, he said he would buy us a PV 50.

And that's what he did. And we rode in the park, um, just outside our house. We had a small park there in Cape town, Ruby road. And, uh, you know how one thing goes to the next, he bought a. A 50 CC vehicle bike. And then, uh, we went to the motocross track for the first time. We would ride around and he would like kind of run after us, you know, when we, when we rode, because we would crash and he would just run behind us.

And then I remember those days, you know, it's, it's, and then it goes to the next class. And then we had our first race and, and, um, didn't do great, but we were like, he was obviously motivated for the next one. He loved it. Mm-Hmm. because it was his passion for us to, to ride. And I think even now, like, um, or I'm living in his, living his dream, basically because he, he loves motocross and.

It's his passion. So that's, I think that's how it started. And you know, when one goes to the next, you start doing well, you win a race or two, then you get a faster bike and you go up to the next category, 65 CC. Yeah, that's, that's how it goes. I think. And, and was it, um, I mean, you won multiple national championships in the younger divisions, moving up all the way to 125, I think it's correct.

And was it, when did it become sort of, when did you reach the point where you thought. I want to be a professional. Or was that always the goal? Um, or, or it was, I don't know if it was like a really. Like it was never like when I was a kid, I was like, okay, I wanted to be the best motocross rider. Um, but that's every kid's dream is to be the best, you know, but you never really think it's possible.

And then, you know, when you start winning some South African championships, um, we had a contact over here in Europe and he used to come to South Africa for, did you ever train with him? Leon, Leon Kiesbos. Did you ever do it? Uh, I know it is, but I didn't specifically train with him. I trained with John for a bit.

Okay. Yeah. So Leon, he used to come down every year, like just a week, uh, he's a Dutch trainer. And my dad asked him, it was like, we were 85 or something. He's like, look, Leon, like, I'm not going to waste money if I don't think this is actually going to be, um, worth it in the end. You know, it was at the stage where as a family, we weren't financially, um, uh, what's the word?

Like it wasn't just easy for us to ride motocross. It was, it was financially tough. So he said like, um, is it worth it for Calvin to do it? Does he have potential to, to make it as a career or not? You know, be hard, be hard, brutal. Yeah, basically. Um, must be staying in South Africa and just race. And we'll just do it for fun, um, as a hobby.

And, and almost we take it seriously. And can he really do something in Europe? And he said, Calvin has talent. He can definitely try to, to, to make a career out of it. So yeah, he would come every year, um, try train me, try improve. And then when I was on one to five, I made a switch to say like, look, okay, let's, let's try and do this thing properly.

Came over to race a couple of European championship rounds and I did well. And then, um, 2011. Yeah. And then one team actually got in contact with my dad and, uh, they reached out to my dad and said, look, who is Coleman? Like where are you guys from? Basically, they haven't seen my name before. And then, uh, I came to us in 12th, I was full time here in Europe.

Yeah, and since then I haven't left. So, uh, and did you come immediately to Netherlands? I first, the team that contacted my dad was from Germany. So I stayed in Germany for three years. And that was still like, um, I wouldn't say like a pay ride, but my dad was still funding it, you know. Um, they were definitely helping a lot with most things, but still, I was still get funded from my dad.

Yeah. Uh, just no more living costs and things like that. And then when in 2000 and end of 2014, I signed my first professional contract with earning some money. And then that was, that was it. And then I moved to the Netherlands, 2015. Yeah. Sure. Wow. Quite a journey. And I mean, this, this whole time, like, how was it the dynamic as well?

Cause you. Damon, um, how was it, you know, between you guys growing up? I mean, was he Also as keen as you or was he was that something that he was? I don't know maybe Bummed that he didn't make it as far as you did or was he not as motivated as you were He wasn't so motivated again. He was like, even if you speak to him now, he's he's like He's happy with the part that he chose.

I mean, my dad also gave him the opportunity. Like, Damon, if you want to do this, you need to take it seriously. And I was willing to put in the extra effort with training and things like that. And he wasn't, he didn't want to go running. He didn't want to go to the gym. He didn't, he didn't enjoy that, that, that side of, of motocross.

Um, the trading side. Um, even at the track when my dad was like, come, you gotta do like a 20 minute motor with a stopwatch. He was like, no, I'm not gonna do it . You know? Okay. And you cannot reach, um, this level without wanting to put in that extra effort. Yeah. And he was smart and he went to, he wanted to choose Uni University, uh, over motocross.

Mm-Hmm. . And he went to university and he's actually, it was difficult for let's say me and him 'cause we grew up together 24 7, you know? Yeah. And then. I just, when I was, you know, 15, when I came overseas, it was like, okay, you are kind of on your own. I came, came over, my mom and dad would like come back and forth.

But they were basically, yeah, they were based, uh, based, uh, in Cape Town still, but like my brother, he was still in school, so he didn't come ever, you know? So it was like to be kind of, you know, Not torn apart because this is something that I wanted to do really badly. Uh, and he wanted to do his schooling, but it was, I think, more difficult for him than, uh, than it was for me.

But now he's, um, he's moved to Netherlands also and he's living. Oh, really? Yeah. I didn't know that. Yeah. He's living in Maastricht. And from here, it's like one hour, uh, last year he was living with me the whole year. Cool. And, uh, yeah, he moved out, um, beginning of this year, he, he got a new job and, uh, moved out.

So, yeah, it's cool. Nice to have him close, uh, close by. Yeah, it's cool. Uh, I mean, also like moving to the Netherlands, I moved to Germany a few years ago and it's, it's hard, um, if you, you know, to leave friends, family and, and adjust to this new way of life. Like. New culture, new language, new. It's. It's a lot.

It's, I mean, it's helpful. You've got a partner as well. You know, when you've got a partner that's also, that is from the country, it helps for sure. Um, but it's still, you know, it's never quite the same as, there's just, yeah, there's, there's things that people will never understand, you know? And that's why it's interesting to spot a South African just like that, because they say something and you're like, crazy South African.

It's crazy. At a restaurant, like you're sitting and you hear like five tables down, you hear like a South African accent. And it just, it's like. And I say to my girlfriend, like he saw that and she's like, how do you even hear that? I was like, you just know, you know, it's quite funny actually. But it's true.

Like when I was that age, let's say, um, 15, 16 on my own. You don't, you don't realize it so much like a new, new culture, new, um, country, everything like that, because you just have one goal is to ride your motocross bike. But now I, for example, if I would have to move now at this age, Then it would be more of a difficult, more difficult time also leaving the family.

Leaving friends, I think it's more tough now than it was back then. Yeah. But it's still hard being, you know, being so young and now you just throwing the deep end on the other side of the world. Um, alone. I mean, not completely alone, but it's, it can feel quite isolated. Yeah. And, and many people say like, That down must mean tough back then.

I didn't see it as being tough. I was like, I've been given this opportunity, you know, I need to make the most of it and you know, I'll, I'll see my family when I see them the next time, you know, I need to, and I just loved riding bikes. I just loved riding bikes. And I want to try to make a career career out of it.

And this opportunity only comes once I need to make the most out of it. And it was never like, Oh, it's hard. I'm on my own. Of course, the days where You have a bad race or you're injured and then those are the tough times. But if I could do it all over again, I would do it all exactly like, uh, like I've done.

Really? Yeah. That's cool. That was actually one of the questions I was going to ask you, so that's, uh, that's good to know. Yeah. I mean, no regrets. No, not at all. Um, it's, things have gone so Sometimes shit happens and you're like, why does this happen? And then a couple months later or a year or two down the road, you're like, okay, that's why that happened.

It's like, everything's worked out so well and it's, you cannot really plan it. You know, this is something you cannot plan. And it's worked out really well. So that's why I say I have no regrets. Like, okay, one or two decisions that I made along the way, um, I would change. Um, but it's also about learning, you know, you made the wrong decision because you don't know better at the time.

I think quite a lot of people have tried to do this over the years, especially from South Africa. There've been quite a few people and, and. Not many have succeeded. And I know myself for, for downhill, for example, how different it is in South Africa versus Europe. It's like you can be winning everything in South Africa and you think, Oh, this is, you know, this is easy.

We come to Europe and smoke everyone and you get here and you get absolutely dropped. And you know, what's the biggest difference or biggest challenge coming from South Africa to race in Europe? You know, even if you winning everything in South Africa, what is, what does that look like coming over? Yeah.

It's so, like you said, so different. It's like, it's for me, the biggest thing was like, even in South Africa, you have like 10, 15 guys, uh, that are on the gate in motocross is different to downhill. You like individual, you know, your timing, but for us, we all start behind the gate, um, with like 10 guys, but yeah, it's like 40 guys, you know, and already having 40 guys going into the first corner is a lot different than having 10 guys and those 40 guys all know how to start in South Africa.

I was the one guy who getting a whole shot all the time, you know, And it's, you have a just different mindset, uh, the tracks get so much rougher, the bikes need to be so much different because of the, the rougher conditions, uh, the weather conditions is so different than South Africa. Riding in the rain.

Yeah. I mean, like in South Africa, when you had a little bit of rain, they would cancel the rain. Yeah. I remember. Yeah. And, and yeah, it's. It's like the worst storm you can imagine. And we still still going out for siding map. And it's like, why are we racing in this? But just these conditions, you don't get experienced, uh, to in South Africa.

It's just all about experience. I think you cannot expect to, to come here and win straight away. If you haven't been, uh, been here and experienced at all. So I think it's a lot of people come and try it. Oh, it doesn't work. They go, you cannot, you have to come try, learn. And really, um, just learn and get better all the time.

Those, um, first years when you came over, did you go back in the off season or did you just stay here? No, I went back in the off season. Like, especially the first years that I was here, like, I couldn't wait till the season is finished that I could just go back home, you know? Yeah. Um, like, I don't know how for you it is in Germany, but where I was living, it was like in the middle of nowhere.

Yeah. I had no friends, uh, no family. Like it was so boring. Yeah. Um, back then social media wasn't really a thing. Um, I didn't have like an iPhone or anything like that. Um, so I would basically come here for the season, um, arrive like a couple of weeks before the first round and then leave directly after the last round.

And then I would spend like four or five months in Cape Town, um, during the, that's October, November, December, January, February time. And then every year it's kind of just gotten shorter and shorter and shorter that I go home. More, uh, obligations to do here and more testing and things get more professional.

And also I have, I've started a life here, so it's, yeah. And did you not feel that that maybe held you back a little bit, not being able to train, so training on like South African tracks, uh, in the off season and coming over here sort of, I dunno, cause I know for me being in Cape town, it's, it's a completely different world.

So you come back and it's a bit of a shock to the system. Yeah. Ideally, I could have been in Europe when I was on 65s, 85s, in these conditions. Um, I wouldn't say, I can't say I would be a much better rider, but I would be a definitely more skilled rider if I was growing up, if I grew up in these terrible conditions here, the weather, track conditions, things like that.

So for sure, going back to South Africa, um, to train in, in the good conditions, the sunshine, there was also positive to that, but it was also a negative to it, like you say, because the conditions are just. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was something that, I mean, I had to because financially it was just easier to go back and I didn't need to, um, you know, spend the, I also didn't want to spend the, the whole winter period alone in Europe.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's quite, that's the thing I struggle with the most, to be honest, just the, not even so much the cold, but just the darkness, you know, it's dark at four and it only gets light it's like nine and it's suddenly the day is over, you know, something to get used to. Like I, I hate the, the, the cold, the weather, I honestly don't, don't like it.

Uh, thankfully for me, like December is when I start my training again. So. The tracks and stuff here are quite bad. So I always leave and I go to Spain and go to where the nice places are. So I don't really spend so much, so much time in the, in the cold, but I don't, uh, it's good. Like you need to experience those days, the shitty days.

You need to also have that sometimes you can't always have it. Uh, good conditions, sunshine. Yeah. It's, uh, I guess it's funny in Cape town, the minute a raindrop falls, everyone's like, Oh no, exactly. That's different, different, uh, Different mentality, different cultures. And, um, I mean, we were just talking about like your whole process of moving here and everything.

I'm sure that, uh, there must've been some difficult times, uh, also mentally, uh, dealing with that. What was the, you know, the hardest moment for you throughout your career? And, and was there ever a moment where you thought, I don't want to do this? Or was it never the case? Good question. Um, I think the hardest moment in my career was when I look back now, like back then I was like, Oh, it's fine.

I'll get through it. But that's just the mentality that I had then. But now was, I had a really bad elbow wrist injury. 2000, beginning of 2015, just when I signed my first contract, I was out for like six, seven months and I damaged a nerve, which I couldn't really feel my hand. Yeah. And back then I was like, ah, it's, it's fine.

It'll get better. But I didn't really realize how serious I could have been. That could have been in the end of my end of my career. Luckily I had quite a good support system around me that helped me through the, the injury. But, um, yeah, that was, that was tough. And then there was another one in 2000 and, um, two 20 where I, um, I had a back her hernia and I was honestly like, um, it was, that was a tough time.

Like I, I deleted my social media, I deleted everything like that really just 'cause I was like. A little bit of a depression, um, I came home from the hospital. I had to call a friend to pick me up from the hospital. I came home. He obviously needed to go, um, leave. And I was just lying on my couch. Like I couldn't move for a couple, for a week before I flew back to Cape Town.

And I was lying on my couch. Like, um, what am I doing? Let's say in pain on my, on my own. Uh, so that was tough. Um, but you get through it. There's no other, there's no other, you don't have an option to not get through it. So you get through it, but there's never been a, A second in my mind, like, Ooh, no, I'm not going to race anymore.

Maybe you should think about it. Obviously now with injuries and stuff, you mentioned a few of them. Um, and now you're just coming back from one as well. I mean, that's just the nature of the sport, but, uh, what has been, what is your motivation, like when things are really bad, I mean, what is the thing that keeps you going?

You know, keep, to keep getting back up. Um, because I think that's the big question that like a lot of people, I want to be world champion, I want to be this, but it's like, why, what is it? I would love to, to, cause for me, the biggest thing is like making my parents proud, like they, they've sacrificed so much for me and for me to one day be able to.

Um, it's not about money or whatever like that, but just to be like, look, guys, I've done it. Thank you so much for giving me that thing. You know, it's that's, I think that's my, that my main motivation, like when I'm, when I'm having injury or whatever, I don't really think about it, but maybe subconsciously that's, that's, that's in my head.

That's cool. Cause I think that's what I would love. Everyone's got their reasons. I would love to just like win the title, pay them back everything that they've, they've given me, you know, but that's, uh, yeah, that's. You never know. I mean, yeah, that's cool because I think, uh, it's something that I don't see gets asked a lot because everyone's like, you know, you're motivated, da, da, da, but what is the actual, like, what, cause everyone's got a different reason.

Yeah, for sure. Um, and, uh, yeah, maybe switch. Yeah. Like, I honestly, I, I love motocross as a sport. Like I'm so passionate about the, the sport. Um, that's also why I love it just because, I just love to ride bikes. Um, and I think over the years, my love for racing bikes has changed. Um, it's become more of a job racing, but I still love to ride bikes.

Yeah. Um, and I think that's also my motivation always to come back, just to get back on the bike, like even now, like, Three weeks off. I'm like itching to get back, you know, that's a good sign. Yeah. And the day that it stops is when I'm going to stop. Yeah. I think that's a lot of people can suffer from burnout and things.

So it's, uh, if it becomes your job, so that's cool. Um, I know that you do a bit of cycling as well. Um, quite a bit of road. Have you ever, have you dabbled in mountain biking at all? At any point? I do mountain bike, but like, yeah, mountain biking in the Netherlands, it's like, it's like in the forest, like some single tracks, but it's not like proper mountain bike stuff, you know?

I would love to. I've never down like done downhill before. Yeah, I would love to do it. I'm actually, so that's one of the other things I would be interested to know is what your thoughts are as a professional motocross rider about downhill, because in the downhill world Yeah, there's a huge fan base for motocross.

Yes. And I think a lot of downhill riders idolize motocross rider and, yeah, I met a couple of them this year. They came to some gps. Oh really? Obviously I'm close to Teo Erling. Yeah. Oh, really? Okay. So, um, I follow him, um, and then obviously he's connected with quite a few other, other guys and Ike, Ike Larson, you know, Ike, um, so I met, they, they came to watch a GP this year, which was quite cool.

Um, and then I met some of them, but yeah, what I was actually watching the other day down here on TV, it's actually insane what you guys do. Like it's, it's crazy, like the speeds that you go and the, the trees and, you know, the Fuck, I would never, I would never do that. It's so interesting because It's dangerous, man.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I did motocross for 10 years. Yeah. And never broke a bone. And I had a lot of big crashes, but never broke a bone. And then started downhill and was just like, bam, bam, bam, bam. Exactly. Broken hips, broken wrists. Oh, man. Just, yeah. So I think the difference is, so for us, like me looking in like moto is gnarly, um, but it's, I guess it's different because it's gnarly because you're racing 40 guys.

And obviously you can crash if you're riding on your own, but I think the likelihood of you crashing just riding on your own is far less than when you're racing. Yeah. Because you've got, you know, it might not be any fault of your own. Um, and plus you're doing it so much longer. Um, and there's so much racing.

Um, it's, I don't know how many races you guys have, but you know. We have 20 Grand Prix's. Yeah. That's not as much as the U. S., but it's still a lot. I think there's 31 races in the U. S. It's just like mental. But, uh, They race like one day, you know? Yes. They only race one day. You guys do a qualifying day. We do a Saturday, which is also now a qualifying race.

Yes. Which is a 20 minute plus two lap qualifying race. And then Sunday also two races. So, yeah, 31, they race 31 weekends. That's, that's a lot. That's too much. And even us, we race 20, 20, 20 Grand Prix's. Including qualifying race. That's 60 races that we race, you know, it's, it's, it's crazy. It's, uh, yeah, it's, it's, so it's, it's a different, I mean, it's different, but it's for us, we like motocross is gnarly, but then when I've spoken to some motor riders, then some of them have been like, Oh, you guys, you guys are crazy motocross.

Sending it off cliffs and trees and rocks. I see what you guys do. That's so it's crazy. Yeah. I guess it's all what you get used to for sure. And I think I've done like this one heel in Belgium where you can kind of like, I went on a mountain bike one time and there's like some, some rocks down the hill, I mean, some, some, and I was looking, I was like, a lot of the times like I got off my bicycle, like pushed it down the hill because I was like, I'm not going to do this shit.

But I can imagine if you do, if you in it all the time and you have a proper bicycle, you know, it's, then it's. Definitely. I mean, yeah, if you ever have some time off and you want to do something different, I would love to, like my girlfriend's family has a house in leisure. Sick. So we went, we go there for Christmas every year.

And like, but it's, it's different. It's ski season. Yeah. I said, you still see the trails and stuff, um, when it's, when it's not snowing, but, uh, I would love to go there in the summer, but I can't because it just, my season is too, too busy, but I would love, I think after my career, I would definitely go there in the summer and, uh, try downhilling.

Yeah. Definitely. It's got a lot of, even though it's different, it's got a lot of things that lend itself. I mean, some guys, I know Roxon does a bit of mountain biking as well. I've seen some videos. It's not bad. Um, but, uh, it is different. I think the people assume because they've sort of got motor on this more of a pedestal.

Then they assume, like, when they heard that I did motocross when I was younger and then I came to downhill and they were like, Oh, but then it's like downhill is easy for you. And I was like, it's a complete different sport. Some things are easier. Yes, for sure. Like hitting a big jump is easier because you're used to hitting bigger jumps.

But the difference is now you're hitting that jump and you've got no motor. So when you get to the takeoff, if you're going too slow, there's nothing you can do. It's sort of like the point of no return. And And also when it gets steep, that was something that was hard to, to adjust to because motocross is flat.

So, uh, yeah, it's different, but then at the same time going back to moto is also, so, you know, it's just so hard. Yeah, I think you learn the basics of, of moto, but a lot of moto guys have transitioned to, Oh, they, they have a background. Yeah. That's interesting that there's quite a few that have gone, gone. I follow a few of guys like Reese Wilson.

He also has like a little motor background. It definitely helps for sure. And also for, for training wise and stuff, just, uh, getting used to the speed and, and, and you can write, do it much longer, so that's the thing with downhill, but I've seen now with downhill, like. I thought downhill guys just like party every weekend and they're just like, um, obviously they take it serious when they're there doing their run and stuff.

But. It's actually quite serious with how hard you guys train. Actually, I can see it, but Theo, he looks like he's on the gram. Like he's just living a good life, but he's training hard. Like he's getting more, more and more nowadays. It's, you know, when I started 10 years ago, it was, um, Talent could bring you a long way, um, and for sure you needed to be, you needed to be fit and stuff, but it's, it wasn't anywhere near the level it is now, um, and I think the level at the very top hasn't changed that much, um, the guys that are winning, but there's just way more guys that can win now, and then the gaps between have just done this, so.

the depth of field is so much bigger. Um, I mean, if you've got, for example, there's six, so how it works is 60 guys are qualified through the first round and then it goes through 30 guys to the final. And there's normally about 150 to 200 riders that are trying to qualify for that 60. Yes. And the 60 will be on a four minute track will be separated.

I often less than 10 seconds, you know, so it's like 10 guys on a second, you know, so it's crazy. You just dab a foot or something and you're out. So I think that's, uh, that's made it challenging, but, um, it is getting more professional, but it's still a long way behind motocross because the sport only started in the nineties.

Yeah, true. But like even motocross is so far behind other sports. That's, so that's just how it, how it is I think. But yeah, it's cool. Cool to, uh, to see I haven't ever gone to downhill event like I want. I really want to go and watch. I mean, I actually want to come to a gp. I had been to one GP years ago.

It was one was in South Africa. I went to watch Sun, sun City. Mm-Hmm. . Um, but I'd love to go back and see another one. Um, so yeah, maybe, maybe next year can make it happen. Um, cool. I also went to Sun City when I was, uh, when I was younger, 2005 I think it was. Yeah. Crazy. I saw a photo the other day. Um, I had a Ben Townley shirt on, I actually sent it to him.

I actually sent it and I think he was on the podium and I was watching the podium and it's the picture from the back. That's cool. And, uh, yeah, it was cool, cool memories. And, uh, you must come watch the GP sometime. Yeah. I'm surprised you had, when did you move to Munich? 2020. I'm surprised you haven't come.

Believe me, every year I've been like, I need to go. I need to go. And actually I wanted to watch MX on the mix of nations. Um, yeah, I would love to go. Um, but it's always with, there's always so much going on. And then when I can do it. It's not the right time. And then when there's a GP relatively close, then I'm away.

And so it's always, I don't know, but it's going to happen for sure. Um, just let me know when you come. Yeah, cool. Um, hopefully you'll be back on the bike then. Yeah, for sure. I need to time it. For sure. Um, And talking of that, so making the NXON team 2018, like, and then you guys were on top of the box, right?

2019, yeah. Ah, 2018 I rode in America for them. Yeah. I had an injury with my eye. Uh huh. And then we finished second. And then 2019 in home country one. Yeah. Like that. Yeah. Take me through that. Like how, I mean, first of all, when did you, how come you, so did you, what was the plan to switch to, um, to that team?

That was never a plan. That just kind of how, how it happened. Uh, I remember I won my first Grand Prix. In 2018, uh, with South African flag, I still had a South African, I was still riding for South Africa back then. Um, but after that GP, um, MSA, like the motorsport South Africa, uh, community, they, um, they sent an email to, to MXGP saying that I haven't asked them permission to ride with their, with their flag because I was riding on a Dutch license.

Permission. Why do you need permission? Because if you're riding with South African license, then you automatically have permission, but I haven't, hadn't paid MSA for the license. Oh, yeah. Um, I was riding with a South African flag, but with a Dutch license and that was allowed from the Dutch Federation because I had asked for that or requested that.

And I had paid for my license to the Dutch Federation. Yeah. Um, but they helped. It was free. They gave it to me for free because I was racing, uh, you know, that, that level. So then after that I was like, you know what, screw you guys, I'm just going to change the Dutch, uh, Dutch flag. And since then I've raced with the Dutch flag.

So that came about in 2018, um, obviously I have a Dutch passport, so it's, it's, um, I am half Dutch and, uh, I've raced for the, the, the Amix, Amix of Nations for the first time in 2018. And then, yeah, second, and then you won. Then second. And then the year after we, uh, we won, you know, at home. At home. At home.

Yeah, in Assen. That was quite special. Yeah. It was, um. A lot of fans were there. Obviously that's the most pressure that I've ever felt. No, really that I've ever felt in a motocross race ever. Like when you're racing a GP, of course you have pressure, um, from me, be put on yourself, but from the team and everything, but there's not so many, like if you have a bad race or bad weekend, it's like, okay, next weekend we can try again, you know?

And with the nations, it's like the whole country is like watching you. Yeah. And if you. Do a bad race or, you know, it's like you are the fault. You don't really have a chance to try again next weekend. Yeah. So it was a lot of pressure. And it was, I remember I woke up, it was raining a lot. I did one on Saturday.

I rode well, um, qualified second. And then, yeah, it was raining a lot. And I was like, Oh, you know, I'm just, you were still in MX2 then. I was still MX2. 250. And I had obviously Jeffrey, um, Harlings is my teammate and Glenn Koldenhoff, and they both did really well. I knew that they were going to do well. Yeah.

Um, I just needed to do my part and uh, and I did. So I was. Some big, big names next to you. Yeah, huge relief. Like pressure off my shoulders when I finished that second moto. Like, huge. That was good. I was expecting to be more of like a, a party afterwards, like just to celebrate with the Federation. But like, I remember we, we just We had dinner all together and I walked into the room like happy and everyone was just quiet like and I was like what's going on but it was yeah that's that's dutch people really yeah they were just like that was gonna be just eat eating their food and no one was really like celebrating so I was like okay and just ate my food quietly with my family and then we left that's so serious it's like you just won the motor conservation I know I saw all of them late and at the Monster Energy after party Jeffrey was not drinking, Glenn was not drinking.

Everyone was kind of just like, uh, chilled. That's not, I think that's not what people would expect looking at a bunch of motocross riders. They'd be like, you guys are sending it. No, it's not downhill. It's not downhill. I mean, there were, there were some guys that were sending it, like from different countries, but I guess like maybe Glenn doesn't really drink at all and Jeffrey doesn't really drink at all.

Okay. So. Yeah. Have the, uh, that was actually when, what I was going to ask you next is what's the sort of wildest after party story? What is the after party is not really existing. You know, they do. Like I remember my wildest one is, uh, Paul Stronish has got, uh, he will got world champion in 2017. Yeah. And at the time I was, I think just, just 18 years old.

And then you're like, okay, let's, uh, you know, let's, let's get drunk or whatever, you know, at that age, you just want to, cause growing up, I was never really, you know, Um, uh, I didn't go to like school. I didn't have those after party, like those house parties and whatever. Um, I was on my own here in Europe.

So I was like, and I was quite disciplined. Like I don't drink and stuff like that still now. I don't do that, but this was the final race. Jonas just got champion. He was like a friend back at the time. And I was like, okay, let's go to this after party. And I, there was. Um, free alcohol. Everyone was just giving me drinks because I was there drinking way too much.

And just one time it just hit me like really bad. I was throwing up outside the tent and I remember the, the trainer that I was with. He was also completely drunk and, uh, we still have videos inside the team truck, throwing up inside the base and like, it was just horrible, but it's funny now to think back, but back then I felt, I mean, I had to drive.

We had to drive back the next day, like nine hours, and I felt so sick for the whole nine hours in the car. Yeah, it was, uh, good memories. That's probably the wildest one I had. And then, um, back, like, since then I haven't really gone to an after party or, you know, drink some wine. That puts you off? Yeah. I'm not really a big drinking alcohol kind of guy.

Yeah, I'm, I, to be honest, I'm, uh, not much of a drinker either. I mean, when I say not much, like I, I do drink very seldom, like there has to be a really special occasion, but, uh, otherwise pretty much don't. When I'm like, when I'm home and we're having a braai or something, I'll have a beer with my dad, you know, it's off season, so why not?

But, um, during the season, I don't touch alcohol, um, from January to October, basically. We talked about OnlyFans. Yes. What do you think about? Onlyfans like being into sport because I don't know if you know, but you know in the cycling world There's been some you know issues not issues But the UCI the governing body of cycling didn't want anyone wearing Onlyfans logo to compete I know that there was something like that a couple years ago with moto also I can't remember the company's name, Dan Bilzerian's company, like that.

Ah, yes, the CBD company, it was. It was CBD company, but then there's also another one, no? Or maybe it was just a CBD one. Ah, it wasn't Dean Wilson writing for them? Yes, correct. And then he couldn't, he had like the censored or no censored or whatever on the helmet. I remember that. But I can imagine, if you think about OnlyFans, you think, okay, this is some kind of, everyone knows what OnlyFans is.

Um, so that's what you automatically think, but I think it's cool. I think the more, um, brands we can get into the sport, the better like this. I'm sure that having only fans, like I know because of, um, Logan Carnell, like, um, how much publicity he's gotten from having this as a sponsor. It's only good for the sport, you know, I think there's so many people from outside of the sport, like, Oh, what's motocross.

Then they're tuning into motocross or downhill or whatever. I think it's cool. I think it's, you need to try and get as many, uh, sponsors in. It's interesting because a lot of people have different opinions. You know, you've got people that absolutely love it, and then you've got people that are not for it.

Yeah. And I've noticed that it was something that when I signed with them, it was something that I really needed to consider. Um, but for me, it's only been a positive, um, even though for sure there's the odd person who's not interested, but most people are, have been, especially in the mountain bike world have been really for it.

Yes. But at the same time, it has had various challenges, you know, especially with governing bodies and things. But for me as an athlete, it's been a positive because it's, it's brought me way more media attention than, you know, than I would have had if I had some other sponsors. For sure. For sure. Um, and I've seen the same with, with, Logan in the motor world.

I mean, he's a privateer, but he's gotten a lot of exposure. Um, and, uh, yeah, it's, it's cool to hear that, that you guys, uh, are for, I don't know. I'm not sure if like, let's say a factory team would be happy with it. I don't know, because of having like the manufacturer and it's very corporate. Um, I don't know how they would feel about having a sponsor like that on board.

Maybe I should try, see, see how they feel about it. It's, uh, get in contact with only fans. I, yeah, I think it's, it's also a situation of being new. Um, and it's obviously different. Um, but I think the same thing could be said when, for example, energy drinks came into the sport, um, years ago when Red Bull came up, a lot of people were not, you know, not for it, but for sure.

And now it's sort of iconic to ride for Red Bull Monster or something like that. Um, And it's something that a lot of kids aspire to. And, and I think that's going to be a similar thing with OnlyFans, that it will take some time to change people's perception, but I think it's only good to have more, more money and more exposure coming into the sport.

I agree. I agree. I think it's, I think it's cool. You, like, you can be stoked, I think, to represent a brand like that, or a name like that. I think it's something different. It's, It's definitely, it's uh, good for, uh, good for conversation. Yes. That's like the first people when they see me wearing the cap then, they're like, what is going on?

Yeah. Or they see my car and they don't know what you do, let's say, they have an idea what you do. They're like, huh? Okay. And I'm driving along in my car with my girlfriend, with my fiancee in the car and, And then they see us both get out and I'm wearing like OnlyFans shirt and my car's got OnlyFans on it.

Dude, I can't even imagine. And then they're just like, you can see people looking at you and I know what's going through their minds. And then I tell people, no, I'm a mountain biker. And they're like, what? Yeah. I don't understand. But maybe, maybe the image of OnlyFans would change with having some athletes for sure, because maybe they will in a couple of years, you walk out the car, you know, with OnlyFans on and they don't have that image of you anymore.

Like. I think the judge you, or maybe I don't know what it is, but you know, I think the more math, more athletes that, that they get under the brand, there's actually almost around 300 athletes now across different sports. So it's, it's growing quickly. That's it's long term. And it's only been two years now, two and a half years.

So it's, it's, they're growing fast and I'm pretty sure that things will change, but it takes time. But it's cool. It's cool to hear that you You're a fan. How is the Because I, I think it's different, like, how does it work with Downhill? You don't really have like teams, right? Who like contract you and Uh, yeah, there are teams as well.

Oh, there are teams. Like, like, factory teams? Yeah. Oh, you do? Yeah, yeah. So But it's hard. I mean, they There are only a certain amount of good teams going, you know, like in motocross as well. There's only a certain amount of factory teams. And so the pie is quite small. And if you're not on a big team, I would say, for me, I've And they get a salary from the team.

Yeah. So they're employed by the team. Okay. So it's pretty much the same as motocross. Yeah. Same as motocross, just probably smaller budgets. I mean, the top guys earn good money, but, uh, it's, It sort of drops off a cliff quite quickly. Um, and then I would say if you're not on a good team, then it's better to do your own thing because that's sort of worst situation where you employed, you getting paid poorly or you got bad equipment or the management's not good, you know?

So in my opinion, I've pretty much always done my own thing. Get your own sponsors on board and try to It's more work, but it's also more freedom. Yes. So, much like running your own business or something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get that. I get that. And motorcars you don't really see that, that often.

You see privateers, but it's more Privacy of teams. Yeah, you see it more so in America it seems. Or at least from what I can see. Than in Europe. Going back to the whole Dutch South African thing, I want to say I still feel like I'm proud South African. Like it's, and I, a dream of mine is to raise the nations for South Africa.

Complicated now it's really complicated because I have built up quite a big fan base in Netherlands and I don't know how they would react if I would write for South Africa. Um, but it's something that I still would love to do. And it's something that I would probably maybe consider if it's like my final nations or something.

And I'm like, I really want to write for South Africa. Yeah. Um, I had a call beginning of the year with someone from the South African team and they were like, look, Calvin, if you want to come, the door is open for you now. Um, but I was like, look, I'm quite committed to the Dutch team at the moment. And I still feel like I have a good couple more years in me racing.

So yeah. I'm going to, um, be faithful to them. Um, cause they've also given me a lot and, and I appreciate them like coming, welcoming me into the, into the Dutch team, let's say. Um, but it's something that I still want to do. And I hope that one day if I do do it, that they would understand and respect it because I still like, if I see a South African flag, neck waving next to the track.

It still means a lot, a lot to me. It's hard. I mean, it's, it's hard. Like it's, you can't take that away. You can't change that. You know, you can't take that away. And I can't change that I'm born there and feel that way about the, and live my first 15 years of my, of my life there. Yeah. So, yeah. That'll be cool to see you in a South African flag.

I think, I think it would be cool, would be, um, yeah, I would, like I said, it's a kind of dream of mine. Because I think that's the, the thing. This is sort of the sad part, um, not sad, but for South African fans, because when they, when we see the results sheet and yeah, and you see your name and you see the Dutch flag and we, everyone knows that you actually South African, um, but How much cooler is it when you see a South African flag next to someone's name?

Cause you don't see it often. Exactly. Um, I mean, it's hard. A lot of the fans, the true South African fans, they know that I'm still South African. Like a lot of the times they come up to me at the races, still South African flag. They're like, Calvin, you know, we are happy to see you and stuff like that.

It's. It's, it's still a lot of people know that, um, but yeah, it's, it would be, um, it would be cool one day. Like I'm, I'm close with Camden McClellan. He's the only other South African, um, racing GPs at the moment. Yeah. MX2. Also on the factory team. So it's nice to have another South African family close, uh, close by.

And I'm spending most of my time with them on the weekends actually. Yeah, it's uh, it's fun, it's interesting how even if you travel, when you go across the world it sort of brings you together to another, to another one from your home country. I didn't even know him before I came to Europe, you know. But we, you feel so secluded here because it's sort of you against the world.

And so when you see another person from home, it's like, okay, I'm going to go there. Yes. Yes. Yes. And for them as well. They, uh, I try to help them as much as I can because I have a little bit more experience than them. How old is he now? I think he's 19 now. Oh, so he's, so he's young. 19. Yeah. Yeah, no, he's also got a bright, bright future.

It's cool to see. So still on the motocross of nations and countries and all that, I assume, or maybe I'm wrong, would that have been the highlight of all your sort of best moment of your career or was your first one really like the nations is. For me, lost its, um, lost its name a bit. Like it's, it's not the same as it was maybe five, 10 years ago.

Um, it's different. Like even now that I'm not racing it this year, okay. I'm disappointed in a way, but it's. I'm not employed to race, um, the nations, you know, I'm going there basically for free risking a lot. Um, you know, when we won in 2019, I got, I mean, not a lot of euros from that. It was basically just like a clap saying, well done and, and that was it, you know.

Of course the, the whole publicity I got from it, um, that was, that was worth it. Um, but it's lost its name because of, of that. And a lot of the top riders are skipping it now because it's not in the contracts. The season is so long. They don't want to do an extra round to risk. Um, for nothing basically. I wouldn't say, that was definitely a highlight of my career, winning the Nations, but I wouldn't say it's the highlight.

I think the, the, my GP wins have still been my highlight. Um, them like individual one. Yeah. And now it is like in a team we won. Yeah. So, I think definitely the GP wins. And the, what, best day in your career, would you say it's the one when you won 250's or 450's? Uh, four fifties. Okay. Fifties. That was a, that was such a good, that was last year, right?

2021. Oh, was it 21 already? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And you went, won one, right? Went won one? Yeah. What won? Like, I won the qualifying race and I won both motors on Sunday. I was in, first in time practice, first in three practice. Like, like what? I don't, what happened that day. . I, I wish I like, I try repeat that day.

Every single GP basically. Uh, it was just like going up to the weekend. Um, I felt good. Like I didn't really do much riding on the bike because I knew that physically I was strong and that I felt comfortable with the bike. That year, the bike in the sand was working really good. And I knew that my setup in the sand was like perfect.

Um, so confidence wise was good. And I knew like, this was my time to get on the podium. And then, um, yeah, I just, I rode it. After I won the qualifying race on Saturday, I was like, I can actually win tomorrow. And that was like, my goal was to win. And, um, I knew that if I'd just like, I trusted my bike so much then in the sand, like set up nowadays is such a big thing with the bikes and, uh, my bike then was working really good.

That's yeah, I could just do everything I wanted on the, on the track and with the bike and yeah, all that, all that practice, all that practice at Maltpost back in the day. Yeah. And then at PE, you know, it's kind of, it is really that, that Sardinia brings me back to like PE, like really similar to PE, how it is.

So that's, that's, yeah, that was it. Yeah, the day was pretty special, for sure. Insane. Um, that was, uh, yeah, for a South African fan, for the South African fans that was like, you know, obviously when you won two in, in two fifties, that was already a huge step because not many people have done that, but four fifties, not many guys, there's a very, very small list of guys that have won, especially gone one one.

Yes. Yeah, for sure. And beating guys like Jeffrey and Prado and all those. I mean, Jeffrey's one of the best guys in the sand. So that was, yeah, really cool to see. Did you ever, what's, I mean, what's next for you? Like, did you ever consider going to the U. S.? Or did you always sort of settle on, I'm going to stay in Europe?

I had an opportunity to go to the U. S. a couple years ago to ride for a, like, kind of B team. Because back then I was already considering it. I was like, I really want to maybe go there and explore that, that side of, of motocross and that world. Um, but I didn't want to go to ride for a big team because my career, I felt like I could have gone like this.

And if I was going to go there, I was going to do it properly. And, um, and I wanted to go on a good team. And also I wasn't going to move my whole, I'd settled down here. I wasn't going to move my whole life for, for a little bit of money, you know, just to get by. Um, it had to be a substantial amount for me to convince me to, to move over.

And it wasn't. So that year I decided to stay here. Now I feel like my age, I wouldn't, I wouldn't, uh, go to the race. There may be a couple of rounds I would like to do. It'd be cool to see you. Yeah. I would like to do a couple of rounds there outdoors. Uh, super cross would be a different story. Have you, have you ever ridden any super?

Dude, I've never really like when was it? Two years ago, three years ago, I went, um, for two weeks to watch Anaheim one. And I got a bike from Yamaha and I rode, I stayed at Caleb's place and he took me around to some tracks and I rode some tracks and I was just kind of like, um, getting my feet wet in the U S a bit.

I had a meeting with an agent. Um, because I was looking at maybe moving over there, the whole vibe. And, um, I didn't like like the materialistic. Think about, um, California and maybe it's different if you're in Florida and you're on your own, really on a, on a camp, uh, like on a training facility and stuff, but the whole, I didn't really like the whole vibe and culture there, to be honest.

So, and I'd like, like I said, I didn't really have like a good contract offer, um, to go there. So I was, I was quite happy to stay here over here in Europe. And now I'm comfortable here. I have a good contract, um, good team. Uh, I know all the tracks. I know, know how the series works. I know. And I'm 28, I still maybe have like another maybe three years of racing.

Only? Yeah, that's my goal, yeah. So you wanna, you wanna retire in about three years, is that sort of? Maybe when I'm like, I haven't got a plan, that's not what I'm saying, but I'm saying maybe when I'm 31, 32 is when I'm gonna think. It's quite, it's not that, I mean, I guess it's, it seems to be getting older.

Yeah. Like if you look at guys like Chad Reed and stuff, they've gone on to almost, you know, almost 20. Yeah, sure, sure. But I, like I said, if I still have that fire in me when I'm 32, I'm still going to race because that's what I love to do. But if I don't have that fire in me, it could also be next year that the fire goes out and you don't know.

Yeah. So. Um, but that's in my head, my long term goal is to race until I'm 32 and then we see maybe I can go over to race some races in the U. S. or, or enjoy, enjoy a little bit of the sport. Yeah. Cause you, you lose that over the years. You lose the fun. Yeah. That's something. It's one thing with injuries actually that as much as injuries suck, I think that time off actually does, does you good mentally.

Sure. Yeah. So he said help me on that. Um. Because it's hard to go like, you know, back to back to back every year. Yeah. It's like one thing is, is like I said, I'm still learning, but it's been very much a learning curve to find like the balance between taking it serious and then also having fun and enjoying life.

Yeah. And that's something that's, and every rider is different, you know, and a lot of the trainers teams, they look at some of the good riders and they're like, this is how you should be. But. Um, for example, Jeffrey, he's like all in all the time, you know, so like, it's everything to him. Not now anymore, but back then.

And Caroli was like completely different, you know, didn't change, didn't change the heart off the bike. Um, really enjoyed his life, went to sleep late, you know, just ate whatever he want. And I think that's maybe why he, he did stay in it as long as he did. Yeah, exactly. And, and that worked for him, but that would never work for Jeffrey.

And every ride is different. So it's been, for me, I think coming from South Africa, we have quite a laid back, um, feeling. And when I take things too seriously, when I like go into, like, too serious of a, it pushes me away from the sport. And I've definitely had years where I like, I don't enjoy racing, I don't enjoy, Not motivated to get up to train just cause I'm so I'm just put too much pressure on myself.

I think that, and I think that's the, the, the, the balance now is really, I need to, what's important to me is enjoy things outside of the sport. Also, like what I say is motocross is not my life. It's something that I do in my life. And that's been important for me to. Realize and, and to also accept I'm, I'm not going to die for the sport because I know that I'm going to, I have a life off the motocross.

That's more important actually than, um, motocross. Yeah. Um, and that's been difficult to accept, you know, cause as a rider and as an athlete, you always want to give 100%, but it's something that's in my mind that I needed to accept that I'm not like that. Uh, I'm not going to. I'm going to die for the sport and that's okay.

You know, that's fine. A lot of the teams don't want to hear that. A lot of the managers don't want to hear that, but that's just who I am. And that's also the risks that I'm going to take will be calculated. And it's not going to, that's not meaning that I'm not going to go for the win. I'm going to do everything I can to go for a win.

But um, if that meaning that I'm going to get injured, then maybe no, you know, so that's something that I've had to learn over the years that it's also important to, to, to To have a life outside of the sport as well. No, I think that's a really mature way to look at it. And it's something that I think it's, it's good that you figured that out.

Yeah. Because a lot of athletes struggle with that. Um, and I went through this stage where I had my back injury that I kind of did a little bit of research about myself, finding myself. Yeah. And that's. Since then I've, I've realized that and that's, it's been very good for my career and myself and my mental health.

Um, just accepting that. I, uh, yeah, that's, it's interesting that you've, uh, I mean, really good thing for, especially for when you move to the next point in your career. Um, because I know for me, for me as well, as much as injuries suck, that's one thing that they're good at teaching you is about you. And actually what's really important because I feel like many races, um, Um, or many athletes in no matter what the sport, they're so, they can be so focused, which you need to be hyper focused, but can be so driven and focused about this one thing about getting results that when there's sort of nothing else matters.

And when that doesn't work, your whole world like collapses because you're like, what am I now? Like I, I did, I didn't, we didn't do well. So, you know, I don't have any value. And, uh, I think realizing that, that's, that's something you do and it's not more important than life. You know, especially when you've been injured and stuff, just doing basic tasks.

You don't even think about, um, your writing, you're just like, I want to be able to go shower by myself, you know, whatever. Yeah. And, and also what my trainer always says to me is like, um, Calvin as a person comes before cover as athlete, that's also with injuries and things like that. Um, not to rush it, not to, you know, take your time because that's, it's more important to live a healthy life than to not be able to race motocross one day.

You know what I mean? Like. It's, it's, uh, yeah, that's, that's something that's difficult to accept sometimes, difficult to hear. But he is right in the, in the, when I, when he does say that, I'm like, okay, you know, I need to take a step back and put myself first as a, as a, as a normal human being than as an athlete.

I think, I think a lot of where you mentioned the teams and stuff, maybe even sponsors might take that the wrong way. And I think I've found that as well when I've told people like now, for example, after I've had, uh, you know, I don't know if you know, I've had like some pretty gnarly injuries. I've had a hip replacement on the one side.

Oh, wow. Um, but, uh, That's, yeah, that's, that's, that's, that's quite a big, uh, Yeah, so I had, I had a lot of time, like basically two years where I was having to contemplate what I'm going to do and whatever. But as much as that time sucked, it was also, it's so good to figure out what makes you happy. Outside of, outside of this thing that you do, you know, and, uh, now I have way more fun riding and even racing, even if the result is not as good as I want.

I still enjoy it more because, um, it's not just about the results. Yeah. I try to enjoy the process and, and. that makes you enjoy it more, which generally makes you actually perform better. For sure. And it's just like a big circle, you know, and, uh, also getting, you know, you've got a, you've got a partner now and stuff.

I think that also it's good for your other relationships, you know. Yes. And I 100 percent like what you say. It's, uh, It's, but it's difficult, um, to realize that from, if someone else is telling you, like, yeah, if someone says to you, like, Oh, enjoy, enjoy the journey, it's more important, but you think like, oh, okay, whatever.

But it's actually, when you really understand that, then it's like, you need to really understand it yourself to, uh, really fully understand it. But it's, it's true. You do enjoy the. Enjoy the racing more if, if that's, if that part is, is there. But it's, when you tell people that, then they, they can often see it as, Oh, he's not as motivated anymore.

He doesn't want it as much. It's, it's, it's not that. Like I said, like I said, for teams, when they hear, Ah, he's not going to die for the sport. Or he's not, it's like, I want you to risk your life, son. Yeah, but that's, that's, at the end of the day, that's what they want. You know, they, it's, it is a business at the end of the day for them.

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's, that's, that's what they, they don't really like to hear that. But in a, in a side, then I always say like, what would you do, you know, as an athlete, put yourself in my shoes because there are people that are riders that do, you know, motocross is their whole life and they see it as that.

And life is, um, that's, and teams love that from athlete or from a rider. Um, but yeah, some people are different, but you also need a rider on the start line, so you don't want a guy that's getting injured. So it's, I guess it's a balance, you know, exactly. And, uh, so you mentioned you've got this, I don't know, not exactly a plan, but, uh, you've got the next few years in mind and, and.

Have you given any thought to what you want to do after racing or do you just want to I wouldn't like like I said before I love motocross like I'm so passionate about the sport and I would still love to stay inside the the industry Don't know exactly what but I would still love to be involved in some way shape or form Yeah, working with athletes.

I think is number one Um, I don't see myself being in a motocross track every day. That's not something that I really, uh, look forward to doing, but to be kind of, um, I feel like I'm a good manager role that could be good for me. Uh, I like, um, I'm very organized, very structured. Um, planning is always really, really a good, strong, um, strong suit of myself.

Something to do with that, or, you know, working with athletes in some, some, some way, yeah, I would like that. And would you still ride after you stop racing? I think I would have a bike. Yeah. Um, I'd have a bike in the garage and I don't know about how often I would ride Because I see it and also a lot the guys stop and then suddenly they're like don't ride for you if it's like snowing outside and like I gotta go do motos like you won't see me outside Like i'll be like i'm gonna stick it but like if you don't I would go in the sun shining But to be honest, I don't know like i'll have to see that when when when that time comes like i'm still You If I think about myself now, like if I can go riding tomorrow, I'd go riding tomorrow.

Yeah, it doesn't matter what, whether it is or whatever, but I'm just trying to put myself in it in five years time or whatever, um, how my body feels about riding or how mentally I feel about riding. But at the moment now I can, I still love riding. So I would ride a lot. Um, but depends also about the job, what I'm doing.

Um, I would still like to, to be involved in maybe a testing role, riding, testing bikes. Um, we'll see. We'll see. I'm not, uh, I don't have a plan. See how it goes. Yeah. I see how it goes. No fear. When a few will titles and I don't need to work, I just do it for fun. You know, that opens up a lot of doors. And so something I'm, I'm planning to ask all the guests as like a final question is, so what does success mean to you?

And what do you think has been the biggest factor in you being successful and getting to where you are? What does success mean to me? Of course, you got to think success is also finance thing, like financially for my, my goal. Um, success would mean to be financially stable without having to work when I'm like 35, 40 years old, that's for me, um, a goal.

And then I'll really be like, okay, look, I've really. I've been successful. I can look back now and say I've been successful in my career. And if I stop tomorrow, I've been, I can be proud and I've succeeded, you know, it's a good question. I wanted to give you a question that's going to make you think, um, cause I think that's, that's kind of the goal that I had with this podcast as well.

The first thing I think of is, um, financially successful. Um, but that's the thing you can, you also like, you never have enough. You always want more. So when is it that you are financially successful? Uh, when are you successful with, with racing a motocross bike? It's, it's, you always want more. Uh, I could, I could have said a couple of years ago, I want to win a Grand Prix, then I'll be successful.

Or I want to, when I was, you know, I want to get a contract or race MXGP, then I'm successful. Yeah. I feel like I'm successful already. For sure. Yeah. But, um, there's still a lot more to be, to be a lot more goals to be, uh, achieved and a lot more to, to win from it for sure. And, and, like, is there anything that you can think of, like, that's actually been the main factor that's gotten you to this point, um, you know, cause obviously many people try to, they have this dream, they want to be world champion in various sports, but very few, or they want to win at the top level, but very few actually do.

So, um, you know, is there anything that you can, uh, I mean, that's, with this podcast I ultimately, ultimately want to help people outside the sport have that, you know, find that thing, you know. I think the number one thing. I've had is discipline and that hasn't come difficult to me. It's a natural thing that I've got, that I've got from my parents.

Um, I'm just very disciplined in, in what I do and how I do it. I remember like when I was 12 years old, when I started training and my trainer would put like 30 minutes runs, I had to do 30 minutes. I couldn't do 29, you know, and. Cause I knew if I did 29, I would be cheating the system. And I've always been very disciplined with what I need to do.

Um, so that, you know, when I'm done with my career, that I can look back and be like, I've done everything that I, that I can do. Yeah. Um, not that I've taken short shortcuts, then, then that wouldn't be, um, you know, maybe that's another thing. I wouldn't be feel like it's, it's a success because I've been taking shortcuts and then always have the what ifs.

So, um, I think. I've been very disciplined, um, throughout my career. And I think that's also why I've, um, why I've gotten to this level and, and hopefully can continue to grow, get better. Dude. Uh, thank you so much for, for making the time for this. It has been really cool. Catching up and, uh, yeah, reminiscing all times.

Come watch a GP sometime. I'm keen. I mean, I've been saying it honestly for the last probably have some more time next year and you can come and watch. Um, we, we do have a GP in Germany, uh, in Töchenthal. Yeah. It's, um, when does the season actually run? Uh, so where's the main beginning of March? Uh, it starts and then now there's the last, last GP.

Uh, so end of, end of October or end of September, end of September. Okay. So you, yeah, well, then you, I guess you'd be just ready to ride when the season's done. Yeah. So that's, I still have, my goal now is to be back on the bike in two weeks, just after the last race. Um, but I need to, I have quite an important testing that I need to do in October, um, to get ready for next year.

So that's, that's my focus now. And then I can go on holiday.

That was iconic.